New Hymns

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Jobam

Jobam

Well-Known Member
I turn 60 this year. Can we please find hymn writers that can write something for my generation.

There are about 8 songs/hymns that I like in MVU.

I am listening more and more to the the 70's channel on Sirius/XM Radio. Can't someone write hymns in the style of the 1st and 3rd line repeating the same tune etc.... none of this flowery stuff. Who sings in minor keys on the top 40, oh wait - No one! Lets just alienate ourselves even more.

If you ever want to attract younger people you have to write the style that is current - not what the current hymn writers think is modern. 70's isn't current but the format is pretty much the same.

Are there no hymn writers out there that can mimic current music styles?

Am I the only one who wants to bogie in church. Really! I want to have my worship come alive. Time is short and I want to enjoy worshiping my God.
 
Those aren't called hymns, those are called praise songs. I imagine that somewhere out there, there are United Church congregations using them (Metropolitan here in London was doing a contemporary service with a praise band at one point but not sure if they still do) but they generally tend to be the province of the evangelicals. So, yes, people are writing them. Unfortunately, you might have some issues with the theology and social views of a lot of those people.
 
Mendalla said:
Those aren't called hymns, those are called praise songs. I imagine that somewhere out there, there are United Church congregations using them (Metropolitan here in London was doing a contemporary service with a praise band at one point but not sure if they still do) but they generally tend to be the province of the evangelicals. So, yes, people are writing them. Unfortunately, you might have some issues with the theology and social views of a lot of those people.
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No, I am not referring to praise songs. I am referring to hymns that can be in a modern style. As The Deer Pants, follows a current musical style. I do not consider it a praise song. It has a verse and chorus. How Great Thou Art was considered modern in its time and not a praise song or hymn. It Is No Secret, Church in The Wildwood - are songs. I'm thinking of songs/hymns that can tell a story, relate feelings etc. In The Bulb There Is A Flower, while a pretty tune says nothing in layman terms and even less to the younger generation. And a waltz....really.....Name one top 40 tune that is in 3/4 time??????

What about ballads? There are so many styles out there...why do we not encourage our writers to go beyond the limitations of what they think current church folks want. They will be dead in 10 to 20 years.....lets build up the church....just sayin.
 
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Jobam said:
No, I am not referring to praise songs. I am referring to hymns that can be in a modern style. As The Deer Pants, follows a current musical style. I do not consider it a praise song. It has a verse and chorus. How Great Thou Art was considered modern in its time and not a praise song or hymn. It Is No Secret, Church in The Wildwood - are songs. I'm thinking of songs/hymns that can tell a story, relate feelings etc. In The Bulb There Is A Flower, while a pretty tune says nothing in layman terms and even less to the younger generation. And a waltz....really.....Name one top 40 tune that is in 3/4 time??????
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You're advocating to the wrong guy. I'm not a big fan of top 40 radio. Most of my favorite current artists are indies or at least off the beaten path a bit as far as chart success. In fact, if I check around, I suspect someone like Kate Bush probably has written a pop tune in 3/4, it just didn't make the charts. And I'd love to hear more music on the radio in classic signatures like 3/4.
 
Lets have a competition. Who can write lyrics to I'm Your Boogie Man by KC and the Sunshine Band. Just to start outside of the box. Mendalla, name one of your favorite tunes, and see if someone can write lyrics to it. Doesn't have to be top 40 - just something "you" like to listen to - then get the writer folks to challenge themselves with the different musical format. That's all I'm asking. The point is to take the style of music that we listen to at home/work/car/bar, and convert the format to church. We have all these wonderful translations of the Bible cause we want to speak to the masses, why do we have such an issue with church music?
 
You can't just take a contemporary pop song and add lyrics like you can a classical tune or old classic hymn tune. Copyright law says so. So someone has to write new music in that style for you to write to. And let's be honest. Even most pop songwriters aren't writing that style anymore. Frankly, if you want to get today's kids in church, today's masses, KC and the Sunshine Band is altogether the wrong music. My son would laugh at you (BTW, he's becoming a Springsteen fan and that's a songwriter churches really could get some mileage out of. Unlike KC and the Sunshine Band, he's got some universality to his writing). You'll need hip-hop a la Kanye West and Jay-Z. You'll need EDM-influenced dance-pop a la Chainsmokers. And in 5-10 years those will be passe. If churches have to chase the top 40 in their songwriting, you'll need a religious version of the Brill Building just to keep up with the constant shifting of pop music styles. Better to look at music that has stood the test of time and in pop music, that means artists like Joni Mitchell, Leonard Cohen, Bob Dylan, Lennon & McCartney, and, yes, Bruce Springsteen. Forget the fad of the minute stuff and focus on music that people are still listening to and playing decades after it came out.
 
Mendalla said:
You can't just take a contemporary pop song and add lyrics like you can a classical tune or old classic hymn tune. Copyright law says so. So someone has to write new music in that style for you to write to. And let's be honest. Even most pop songwriters aren't writing that style anymore. Frankly, if you want to get today's kids in church, today's masses, KC and the Sunshine Band is altogether the wrong music. My son would laugh at you (BTW, he's becoming a Springsteen fan and that's a songwriter churches really could get some mileage out of. Unlike KC and the Sunshine Band, he's got some universality to his writing). You'll need hip-hop a la Kanye West and Jay-Z. You'll need EDM-influenced dance-pop a la Chainsmokers. And in 5-10 years those will be passe. If churches have to chase the top 40 in their songwriting, you'll need a religious version of the Brill Building just to keep up with the constant shifting of pop music styles. Better to look at music that has stood the test of time and in pop music, that means artists like Joni Mitchell, Leonard Cohen, Bob Dylan, Lennon & McCartney, and, yes, Bruce Springsteen. Forget the fad of the minute stuff and focus on music that people are still listening to and playing decades after it came out.
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LOL, I hear ya, but you are missing the point. Its the sytle. I'm the one who wants 70's music in church now. Not the younger folks. I agree it will be passe, it needs to change just like the top 40 does. Why does the church have such an issue with keeping current?
 
Jobam said:
I turn 60 this year. Can we please find hymn writers that can write something for my generation.

There are about 8 songs/hymns that I like in MVU.

I am listening more and more to the the 70's channel on Sirius/XM Radio. Can't someone write hymns in the style of the 1st and 3rd line repeating the same tune etc.... none of this flowery stuff. Who sings in minor keys on the top 40, oh wait - No one! Lets just alienate ourselves even more.

If you ever want to attract younger people you have to write the style that is current - not what the current hymn writers think is modern. 70's isn't current but the format is pretty much the same.

Are there no hymn writers out there that can mimic current music styles?

Am I the only one who wants to bogie in church. Really! I want to have my worship come alive. Time is short and I want to enjoy worshiping my God.
Click to expand...

Would this require change or alternation in the institution … according to protocol that avoids mixed allegories? Tis bloody disgusting alternation they'd say … after that outburst they'd be winded …

Is copyright intended to firm up protocol? More reason to depart … martyrdom or suicide if you step over it ...
 
It doesn't matter how big your hymnal, nor how diverse its content. In the end, most congregations rotate around 75 or fewer hymns.

Congregations with accomplished music leadership will push the envelope and increase the playlist.

In most congregations where the musicians and choir are dedicated amateurs, there will not be a lot of experimentation.

Apart from that the money in hymn writing nowadays is having a lock on both the lyric and the tune. Which leads to some pretty difficult to sing stuff.
 
Jobam said:
Lets have a competition. Who can write lyrics to I'm Your Boogie Man by KC and the Sunshine Band. Just to start outside of the box.
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Challenge accepted.

Praises sing to God, fore're with us;
lover of all, it is you we trust!
Be it on the day that / we were born,
or any other, you are the storm
that gives us new life,
that gives us whole life;
we want to live it all, all in you!
We want to be the / best we can,
we want to be the ones,
who share your love, oh yeah!

I'm Christ's disciple, that's what I am;
I'm Christ's disciple, part of the band;
I'm Christ's disciple, that's what I am;
I'm Christ's disciple, walkin' hand-in-hand.

With respect, though, the style of music - the whole folk/rock genre "putasmanysyllablesintoaphraseasyouwant" makes it really difficult to write lyric that has much in the way of depth. It is really more conducive to "here is one idea, now I'm going to repeat slight variations on it, till you get it."

(I'm also of a later era, so KC's genre doesn't really speak to me. I wonder what we could do with 500 Miles, or Rolling in the Deep? ;)
 
RichardBott said:
Challenge accepted.

Praises sing to God, fore're with us;
lover of all, it is you we trust!
Be it on the day that / we were born,
or any other, you are the storm
that gives us new life,
that gives us whole life;
we want to live it all, all in you!
We want to be the / best we can,
we want to be the ones,
who share your love, oh yeah!

I'm Christ's disciple, that's what I am;
I'm Christ's disciple, part of the band;
I'm Christ's disciple, that's what I am;
I'm Christ's disciple, walkin' hand-in-hand.

With respect, though, the style of music - the whole folk/rock genre "putasmanysyllablesintoaphraseasyouwant" makes it really difficult to write lyric that has much in the way of depth. It is really more conducive to "here is one idea, now I'm going to repeat slight variations on it, till you get it."
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Fancy seeing you here, Richard!

That is the usual issue people raise with regards to what is often called "contemporary" (even if it's 3 or 4 decades old) music: it's repetitive and shallow. Some more "modern" songs are that. I have a whole list of "contemporary" songs that I'd refer to as "theological piffle." I tend to prefer the older traditional hymns for theological depth and the newer contemporary stuff for establishing a mood. Some (both older and newer stuff) can do both.
 
Hi, revsdd! *grin* Jobam posted his challenge over on facebook, with a link to the wc2 discussion, so I thought I'd see what was going on over here... and try out his challenge.

Thanks, Mendalla. The church will decide what it decides, I'll be happy to try whatever is next. And I agree - in many ways, the style fits praise choruses. Though something of Haley's, or other indie artists might give more room to work with.
 
Do you think the whole music thing would work better if we stopped calling them hymns and starting calling them songs?
 
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