Can one follow Christ and not be a "Christian"?

[Mendalla]

Pondering on a recent post by @monk and it inspired this question.

To my mind this pretty much summarizes why I could never call myself a Christian:

I do believe that Jesus is a moral exemplar worthy of praise.

So, I know some people would not accept the second quote as being "Christian" but many others do call themselves "Christian" while believing precisely this. And I know there are some who hold even more orthodox ideas about Jesus Christ while refusing the label of "Christian".

If someone believes in and follows in Jesus in some way, does that automatically label them "Christian" whether they want it or not? Would you treat someone who believes as monk does as Christian even if they explicitly said they were not?

We argue a lot about who is and isn't a Christian and who gets to decide that, but does our perspective on that debate change if we make it about the ability/right to refuse the label even if one's beliefs are the same as someone who accepts it?

PS. Not singling you out, @monk . You just happened to provide me with an inspiring example. In fact, I quite like your attitude and approach when it comes to religion.

 

[GordW]

I think that the label "Christian" is one that is taken on by choice. I think many people might follow The Way laid out by Jesus of Nazareth but not take on the theology that comes with being Christian. SO no, trying to follow the way of Jesus does not automatically make one Christian. However I would say that consciously trying not to follow the way of Jesus and/or intentionally acting in ways that contradict The Way of Jesus means one can not be Christian no matter what theological pieces one might accept.

 

[Pontifex Geronimo 13]

You can’t follow Jesus in some way.

He said there is one way.

He said I tell you the truth some 70 times recorded. You can’t say yes to 35 and no to 35 and say you are following Jesus in some way, any more than you can say you are a vegetarian but also eat ribs and steak and chicken.

The ribs and steak and chicken negate the claim of vegetarianism.

 

[Jae]

If following Jesus was what makes one a Christian, I dare say no one would qualify since in my experience no one has ever done it perfectly. I feel the problem with debating over labels is that it tends to be done in an exclusionary way - those who feel they are in the in-camp labeling others in and out as a form of elitism. Such goes against my philosophy of doing ministry with one and all who are so interested. What's important to me in my mind is that everyone can be a disciple.

 

[blackbelt1961]

Messianic Jews do not consider themselves Christian, probably more so because of political reasons but they do not call themselves Christians

 

[blackbelt1961]

If following Jesus was what makes one a Christian, I dare say no one would qualify since in my experience no one has ever done it perfectly. I feel the problem with debating over labels is that it tends to be done in an exclusionary way - those who feel they are in the in-camp labeling others in and out as a form of elitism. Such goes against my philosophy of doing ministry with one and all who are so interested. What's important to me in my mind is that everyone can be a disciple.

My understanding is your not a Christian you're a Baptist

 

[Jae]

My understanding is your not a Christian you're a Baptist

Huh?

 

[Luce NDs]

Jesus is the light and scattered all about for vision ... many Christians wouldn't go that far ... due to minimal pathy ... not enough pain to wake eM!

 

[Luce NDs]

Huh?

Thus the Shadow creeps ... sacred conspiracy if not Charon!

 

[Delightful Life]

Pondering on a recent post by @monk and it inspired this question.





So, I know some people would not accept the second quote as being "Christian" but many others do call themselves "Christian" while believing precisely this. And I know there are some who hold even more orthodox ideas about Jesus Christ while refusing the label of "Christian".

If someone believes in and follows in Jesus in some way, does that automatically label them "Christian" whether they want it or not? Would you treat someone who believes as monk does as Christian even if they explicitly said they were not?

We argue a lot about who is and isn't a Christian and who gets to decide that, but does our perspective on that debate change if we make it about the ability/right to refuse the label even if one's beliefs are the same as someone who accepts it?

PS. Not singling you out, @monk . You just happened to provide me with an inspiring example. In fact, I quite like your attitude and approach when it comes to religion.

Simple answer: yes
Slightly longer answer: if u have 2 ask, you don't know jazz
Longer answer: people can self-identify as whatevr they want*. Wether or not another will support that, that is another matter.

* in various parts of the world this is now enshrined in Law. most parts of the world rely on culture to enact change (a much longer but much safer process)

 

[Pavlos Maros]

If you believe Jesus was the Messiah/The Christ/The son of god. Then by default you are a christian. If you don't. Then you can call yourself whatever you like.

 

[unsafe]

unsafe says----Interesting Read on the word Christian--

--Please Note : unsafe posted ---- unsafe Posted below from Easton's Bible Dictionary on the word Christian ---- I did not write this definition below -----

Easton's Bible Dictionary

Christian

the name given by the Greeks or Romans, probably in reproach, to the followers of Jesus. It was first used at Antioch. The names by which the disciples were known among themselves were "brethren," "the faithful," "elect," "saints," "believers." But as distinguishing them from the multitude without, the name "Christian" came into use, and was universally accepted. This name occurs but three times in the New Testament Acts 11:26 -Acts 26:28 -1Peter 4:16



unsafe says -----The name was actually used contemptuously by the Gentiles towards people who followed the way of Jesus ----

unsafe posts scripture ----

Acts 26:24-32 (NKJV)
Agrippa Parries Paul’s Challenge
24 Now as he thus made his defense, Festus said with a loud voice, “Paul, you are beside yourself! Much learning is driving you mad!”

25 But he said, “I am not mad, most noble Festus, but speak the words of truth and reason. 26 For the king, before whom I also speak freely, B)'>knows these things; for I am convinced that none of these things escapes his attention, since this thing was not done in a corner. 27 King Agrippa, do you believe the prophets? I know that you do believe.”

28 Then Agrippa said to Paul, “You almost persuade me to become a Christian.”

29 And Paul said, “I would to God that not only you, but also all who hear me today, might become both almost and altogether such as I am, except for these chains.”

30 When he had said these things, the king stood up, as well as the governor and Bernice and those who sat with them; 31 and when they had gone aside, they talked among themselves, saying, “This man is doing nothing deserving of death or chains.”

32 Then Agrippa said to Festus, “This man might have been set free if he had not appealed to Caesar.”



unsafe says ----The word Christian today is just that a word used as a label ---the real meaning is lost in the different Religions that have no idea of what the meaning was meant to be -------calling yourself a Christian does not give you a relationship with God -----and that is the real meaning of the word -----Christ is the center of the word--- ian


You can't be a follower of Jesus without Jesus in you -----we humans do not have the power to be a follower of Jesus by ourselves -----we have a sin nature and only Jesus has the power to change that ------

unsafe says -----The true Christ--ian has Christ in them ----

unsafe posted poster

 

[Jae]

How have you decided upon this order of events unsafe?

 

[Delightful Life]

Goodonya folks for not giving in to the need to win
Instead engaging in good ol WC communication
Woot!

 

[Pontifex Geronimo 13]

If you believe Jesus was the Messiah/The Christ/The son of god. Then by default you are a christian. If you don't. Then you can call yourself whatever you like.

I half agree with you. By default the one person is a Christian. The other person should have to by default be a non Christian. As it relates to Christ.

People should not be able to self identify as whatever they want, even though that is the way the world is going .

 

[Mendalla]

Pontifex even half-agreeing with Pavlos is why a place like WC2 needs to exist.

People should not be able to self identify as whatever they want, even though that is the way the world is going .

But who gets to decide who is Christian? The RCs would define Protestants out. Every Protestant denomination would define out at least some other Protestant denominations (look at BB's remark about Baptists) and maybe the RCs. Individual "Christians" define the faith in terms of what they believe and shut out those who disagree with them or with whom they disagree.

In the end, there is only one opinion on this that matters: God's (assuming there is a God). God will judge; God will decide who is a "real Christian" and I suspect that some will be shocked and/or disappointed when the truth is known. I wish all "Christians" would recognize that and cut the sectarian BS. Treating people you dislike or disagree with with contempt and hostility is pretty clearly a worldly thing, not a thing of God.

 

[Delightful Life]

Pontifex even half-agreeing with Pavlos is why a place like WC2 needs to exist.



But who gets to decide who is Christian? The RCs would define Protestants out. Every Protestant denomination would define out at least some other Protestant denominations (look at BB's remark about Baptists) and maybe the RCs. Individual "Christians" define the faith in terms of what they believe and shut out those who disagree with them or with whom they disagree.

In the end, there is only one opinion on this that matters: God's (assuming there is a God). God will judge; God will decide who is a "real Christian" and I suspect that some will be shocked and/or disappointed when the truth is known. I wish all "Christians" would recognize that and cut the sectarian BS. Treating people you dislike or disagree with with contempt and hostility is pretty clearly a worldly thing, not a thing of God.

hear hear
i'd xpand that concept so that whatever tribe one belongs to to stop with the sectarian BS, whatever version of "trans" or "hetero" or "gay" or "atheist" or "Progressive" or "Right" or "Dark Chocolate Lover" etc one belongs to or believes in

it just can't happen tho ("i choose to not believe this")
it requires right work and effort

its esp difficult when something is sacred or blasphemous (which tends to differ according to what tribe one belongs to...)

 

[Jae]

But who gets to decide who is Christian? The RCs would define Protestants out. Every Protestant denomination would define out at least some other Protestant denominations (look at BB's remark about Baptists) and maybe the RCs. Individual "Christians" define the faith in terms of what they believe and shut out those who disagree with them or with whom they disagree.

Er... no. At least some Roman Catholics do accept at least some Protestants as being Christians. Also, I don't know of any Protestant denomination that has totally dismissed any other from consideration. At my evangelical seminary, we are taught these days that Christianity includes Orthodox, Catholic, and Protestant Christians.

 

[unsafe]

Jae ---maybe you like this better it explains the poster in word terms----unsafe says ----How do you become a True Christ---ian

unsafe posted ---6 min video ---OH ! sorry 6 mim and 18 second

 

[Luce NDs]

Pontifex even half-agreeing with Pavlos is why a place like WC2 needs to exist.



But who gets to decide who is Christian? The RCs would define Protestants out. Every Protestant denomination would define out at least some other Protestant denominations (look at BB's remark about Baptists) and maybe the RCs. Individual "Christians" define the faith in terms of what they believe and shut out those who disagree with them or with whom they disagree.

In the end, there is only one opinion on this that matters: God's (assuming there is a God). God will judge; God will decide who is a "real Christian" and I suspect that some will be shocked and/or disappointed when the truth is known. I wish all "Christians" would recognize that and cut the sectarian BS. Treating people you dislike or disagree with with contempt and hostility is pretty clearly a worldly thing, not a thing of God.

One must face dark designations that Christ is out as enlightenment in a world where people prefer not to know much ...